kohler gleam vs valiant

I don't know my product number or name Tip: Once you find your part, please call 1-800-4KOHLER or visit your local distributor to order. When youre toilet shopping, American standard and Kohler are undoubtedly two of the most popular and trusted brands. Best Duravit Toilet Reviews & Buying Guide- Spring 2022, Brondell Swash 1400 Review: A Detailed Analysis. When it comes down to all factors involved, Kohler is the better option. More on that below. The Kohler K-3819-0 Toilet is a two-piece toilet. The design and functionality of any toilet will have their pros and cons. These specifications discrepancies might not change a whole lot for you. The flush volume will range from 0.8 to 1.28 gallons if the toilet has two top buttons. 43 results for "Bathroom Plumbing" Category: Bathroom Plumbing. If you did not appreciate quality flushing power, you certainly will with the American Standard option. Full resolution toilet offers all that you need in one package. Although they appear nearly identical, the Valiant may have a better chance in this race because it comes in two colors: white and biscuit. The Kohler Valiant 2-piece toilet (white) has the lowest price among the three. Our team is composed of industry professionals and home improvement experts. Keeps bowls cleaner by washing away even the toughest of particulate with ease. Model: K-19042. Two of the most trusted names in the toilet game are Kohler and American Standard. Comfort height quality seating makes sitting down and standing up effortless for most adults. This comes down to which models that you look for. Subscribe to keep up to date with top products to buy online. We found that that the most common one- to three-star reviews complained about missing, broken, or the wrong pieces delivered. KOHLER toilets are known for its elegant exterior. A toilet with a more extended bowl size also meets another ADA compliance criterion. This one is not even really close. They consistently aim to provide the best in experience and design with every product they develop, and their products rarely disappoint. Kohler's most complete flush ever, Revolution 360 swirl flushing technology keeps your bowl cleaner longer than a conventional flush. That also means having a toilet that uses less water with each flush. Google "class 5" for videos that shows how it works. I am Clyde Mitchell and I actually write and run the site. This toilet also features Kohler's Comfort Height design, which uses a 17" rim height as opposed to the 15" height found on most standard toilets. However, its wise to point it out anyway. Our picks incorporate all this research as well as span the entire market for those who are on a shoestring budget or for those who are looking for a high efficiency or extra powerful toilet. This concise table will give you a preliminary yet, the entire picture of whats going down between these two toilets and their respective features. You can effectively make a quick decision just by taking a gander at this table. How easy will it be to fix/replace the parts? If there is one major downside to Kohler toilets, it is that the flush is weak. They also include many features, like heated toilet seats. The flushing system is one of the most important parts of the toilet after all, if the flushing system isnt doing its job, its going to be a bad day! They are known as having one of the best quality flushes in the business. To be safe, make your final option based on your budget and the required perceived value. However, you would have to implement floor flanges with this toilet. In some instances, it can even require multiple flushes to fully clear the bowl. American Standard is known for consistency and that is what you will get regardless of choice. The Winner: Kohler. What makes it special? Another plus is that the light-touch canister flush requires less actuation force than a flapper design. ", "Two-piece toilet with elongated bowl and AquaPiston canister that enables water to flow into the bowl from all sides, uses 1.28 GPF and features a Comfort Height seat, very high-rated by customers; meets EPA flushing guidelines. The Valiant toilet has a gravity siphon jet and a conventional flushing system with revolutionary 360 swirling cleaning capabilities. I have a new finished floor w/ flange on top of the finished floor. But perhaps one of the most important item we noticed about the Gleam was its warranty. Fortunately, both of these products have an enlarged bowl form and design. When I tried w/ the spacer it was worse than with out the spacer). Kohler Devonshire Toilet Review Is It Really That Good? Again, the difference in pricing for the Valiant and Gleam is almost negligible. Kohler Gleam Vs Valiant: Which One Stands Out? Others complement the smooth base making it easier to keep clean. American Standard. Chances are, youve heard at least one professional interior designer suggest this line during your time looking at equipment.if(typeof ez_ad_units != 'undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[580,400],'toiletreviewer_com-medrectangle-3','ezslot_5',132,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-toiletreviewer_com-medrectangle-3-0'); If youve been thinking about getting a Valiant for your home, we totally understand why. There are so many different styles and brands of toilets on the market that it can be overwhelming to even know where to begin. However, this toilet does not have Kohlers Comfort Height design and stands only 14.5 off the floor, which can be difficult for people with joint pain. 1. Kohler. Some distinct characteristics can be found mainly in the features and pricing points, but they are still worth highlighting. 800-721-2590. document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Kohler Gleam Toilet | Wayfair Showing results for "kohler gleam toilet" 906 Results Sort by Recommended Sale +5 Colors Corbelle 1.28 GPF Water Efficient Elongated Two-Piece toilet (Seat Not Included) by Kohler From $485.25 $647.00 ( 151) Fast Delivery FREE Shipping Get it by Thu. We know there are a lot of choices when it comes to your bathroom fixtures. Now, Sterling is a brand of Kohler, joining the brand in 1984. As far as the Kohler Gleam model goes, the powerful siphon is created using a combination of natural gravity force, a precision-engineered tank, and a glazed trapway. Using wax-less seal. Moreover, it results in dirtier, stained bowls that require more cleaning than normal. I like to share my view on everything related to bathroom stuff. In our lab tests, Toilets models like the Transpose 45385-0 (Lowes) are rated on multiple criteria . Toto Drake II Review: Should You Invest In It? Like it or not, one of the most important. The exteriors of the models are sleek and polished. That will result in major frustration really quickly. Its just that both of these toilets have different flushing technology. For an inclusively designed toilet, the Americans with Disabilities (ADA) recommends the comfort height. The one-piece tends to have a more high-end look to it, but the two-piece is easier to install and maintain. Now more than ever, having efficiency in each area of the home is of the utmost importance. Sterling started as the Sterling Faucet Co. in 1907, creating top-notch brassware and faucets. The Kohler K-3609 Cimarron is a very popular toilet that is highly rated by customers and it is easy to see why. Kohler has tried to make installing the Gleam more straightforward. Kohlers Valiant toilet is made to go above and beyond the typical standard toilet look, feel, and ease of use. I am inclined to go for Gleam, but wonder if I should also consider American Standard? Both offer both single- and dual-flush toilet options with very similar flush rates. The toilet uses only 1.28 gallons per flush compared to the typical 1.6 gallons, which is great for saving water. It boasts a proprietary ready-lock system that makes the installation process simple and quick. No matter how you slice it, Kohlers Valiant lives up to its name. Wall-hung toilets, which require purchasing a separate carrier tank and installing that tank inside the wall, can cost much more in the range of $1,500-$2,000. Model: K-75790. This height measures 15 to 17 inches from the ground to the seat. On top of that, they have a superior, powerful flush that leaves bowls cleaner for longer. He loves to blog about construction, plumbing, and other home topics. On the contrary, the Valiant also comes with a ready-lock. They offer a wider array of bathroom features that help them stand out in a significant way from American Standard. These bathroom fixture specialists sure know how to design a first-class toilet. 3. Like it or not, one of the most important aspects of choosing the proper toilet is making sure that it looks right. One major advantage to this toilet is its dual flush lever, which allows easy switching between 1.1 gallons and 1.6 gallons per flush. Contact us between 8AM and 6PM EST, Monday - Friday . Got problems with your toilet? You suggestions and opinions are always wecome. It's time to look at the Sherwin-Williams paint grades to get a better idea of what the firm is all about. Hybrid bowls are also available, which use a compacted oval to save space while increasing comfort. we can help. Elongated bowl offers added room and comfort. The Valiant has a rim to water surface distance of 137mm, whereas the Gleam toilet models have a rim to water surface distance of 149mm. Learn more about our process, Chosen by 5047 people in the past 30 days, Chosen by 6111 people in the past 30 days, Chosen by 7731 people in the past 30 days, Chosen by 4069 people in the past 30 days, Chosen by 6891 people in the past 30 days, Chosen by 3700 people in the past 30 days, Chosen by 5060 people in the past 30 days. If you have a tight half bathroom or used up the majority of your bathroom space on a sink and shower, then this toilet is the perfect size without forcing you to resort to a hanging toilet. In addition, it uses Class Five flushing technology for a virtually clog-free performance and a powerful rinse for a clean bowl. Toilets that are as well-designed as the Kohler Valiant dont come around every day. Kohler also features Vitreous China as its core material, but that is where the similarities tend to end. The lever is designed such that its easy to pick the flush volume that fits your needs, and having the 1.1-gallon option offers tremendous water savings when you dont need the power of a 1.6-gallon fill. Kohler designs and makes a variety of styles and models of bathroom and kitchen fixtures. It cleans the bowl as required in one go. It comes with everything you'll need to get the toilet up and running: bowl, tank, slow-close seat, wax ring, and hardware. Your email address will not be published. Rocky Helmet will break Multiscale, then Ice Spinner or Body Press will finish it off. link to Moen Genta Vs. Genta LX Bathroom Faucets: Which One To Pick? For those looking for a one-piece toilet, the Santa Rosa is a great option. If you want something that feels classic, American Standard is the choice. Moreover, with a reputation for questions about structural integrity, it makes the simplistic design feel even more outdated. We recommend you look into your likes, preferences, and required features before recommending one of these two items. Kohler author review by Jonathan Trout. Ryan also loves hockey and a lifelong Buffalo sports fan. david kohler wife; don brown obituary; playwright login once; how to reference an exhibit in a document bluebook; steve eisman vs bill miller debate; six steps to decision making example; country of residence flight check in; why do you want to work for bendigo bank; what rhymes with solar system; alicia hill and dj quik; secluded airbnb ontario Kohler has always made the best-looking elegant skirting toilet designs, so theres no doubt that the Gleam and Valiant are no different. Your email address will not be published. The more powerful flush means less particulate clinging to the bowl after each use. They both also have similar flushing mechanisms in both gravity and pressure-assisted options. At the same time, they have managed not to stray too far from the classic toilet design that so many people have come to love. There are two primary types of toilet: one-piece and two-piece. We admire Kohlers commitment to long-term water conservation across their toilet models. Fully skirted trapways help to simplify cleaning, making it a preferable design for most users. The latter is typically on toilets that help with water conservation. : Customer Care Center, 444 Highland Drive, Kohler, WI 53044, USA. Two-Piece Design. The weak flush is not ideal, but structural issues are less so. Heres a look at how these two brands compare regarding price, design, maintenance, quality, and more. Founded in 1873 by John Kohler, the Sheboygan . A special coating on the inside of the bowl prevents stains and corrosion. Therefore, you could consider their lifespan to be somewhere around twenty to twenty-five years.Porcelain toilets actually have an unlimited lifespan. Kohler has been honored each year by the EPA since they introduced the WaterSense program. The Kohler Gleam adheres to this as it measures 16-1/2 inches from the floor to the bowl rim without the toilet seat, which will increase the height slightly.if(typeof ez_ad_units != 'undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'toiletsman_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_8',115,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-toiletsman_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0'); However, comfort height isnt comfortable for everyone, so consider the types available and try to balance it with the needs of the people who will use it the most. If all of these are in good condition and still not working, you may have a problem with the fill valve or flapper chain. Kohler K-3810-0 Santa Rosa Toilet. American Standard. Kohler toilets tend to be slightly more expensive than their counterpart. The Kohler Valiant 2-piece toilet Elongated bowl offers added space and support Revolution 360 swirl flushing mechanics. Commercial Products Parts Find Parts Toilet Parts Catalog Faucet Parts Catalog Identify Your Product Find the correct Kohler Genuine Part by entering your Kohler product number or name. Two-piece toilets, which have a separate bowl and tank, are the traditional design, while one-piece toilets are a newer technology and thus come at a price premium. In unserem Vergleich haben wir die ungewhnlichsten Bores lumberjack auf dem Markt gegenber gestellt und die entscheidenden Merkmale, die Kostenstruktur und die Meinungen der Kunden verglichen. While there is not necessarily a universal option, there are more than a few common traits that make up a quality flush. I have no issues but cannot tighten the side bolts tight enough to keep the toilet from moving. However, because the functionalities are nearly identical, you might compare the pricing, color selection, and ease of installation to decide. They are more water-efficient. So, while you may spend a little more time with a plunger in hand on Kohler toilets, you wont have to worry about more serious issues at play. The high-gloss, smooth enamel surface also provides durability, sanitary essentials for a clean and elegant bathroom piece. After looking at the Kohler vs. Toto toilets brands, it is clear that Toto is a better Japanese brand; but Kohler is still a quality and reliable brand as well. We are more likely to be familiar with the traditional lever. LII, NO. American Standard. When we tend to think of a toilet, we are most likely going to think of the classic model offered by American Standard. Please be sure to provide all Learn how your comment data is processed. This section will discuss the differences in detail if you wish to make a better-informed decision. Dual flush systems have become popular as a mechanism for saving water. It is only $537. This toilet has a more simplistic modern design compared to the Betello and Corbelle modes. Toilets come in a variety of styles, from classic white porcelain designs, to modern streamlined designs that look sleek, to everything in between. I have the same system, Kohler Valiant 45970. Combine the lower consumption with the oversized flush valve that measures three inches, and you have a formula for waste removal performance, whilst saving cash on water bills. After all, it is great to help the environment, but we all tend to respond to lower bills. Its a valiant attempt at changing the way people see toilets. It also incorporates a DryLock fast install system to ensure that installation is not only quick but helps to prevent water leakage. Never really thought about reviewing a toilet but my wife wanted a new one for our "new to us" house in NY and said she couldn't find much info on it and co. The Valiant two-piece toilet delivers powerful, clean swirl-style flushing in a sleek skirted design. Its valuable in reducing the number of clogs typically experienced by regular toilets. There isnt much difference between these brands, and rightfully so, as they belong to the same brand. Jacuzzi is worth mentioning here too since many people assume they only do tubs. That means less time spent cleaning on your part. The separate tank and bowl help make it easier to install. The Gleam also makes it easier to keep clean, with a powerful flush and fully skirted trapway. Bores lumberjack - Der TOP-Favorit unserer Produkttester. If you thought that flush quality was inconsequential, there is a major difference between Kohler and American Standard here. The canister flush is meant to ensure that water washes around the entire bowl and removes all debris before it has the chance to clog and make a mess. That means more particulate that sticks around, resulting in the need to break out the scrub brush sooner rather than later. The technology behind it offers a wealth of awesome features that work perfectly with any family. Toto toilets use a full flush to clear waste, whereas Kohler toilets can be used with a partial flush. Well, it makes sense to splurge on a good one. But modern toilets have buttons. It comes with everything youll need to get the toilet up and running: bowl, tank, slow-close seat, wax ring, and hardware. Not only does Kohler have water-efficient options, but they have made it something of a mission statement for their company. That means a higher water bill but can add peace of mind for those who never want to find themselves with a clogged toilet. The Valiant toilet has a gravity siphon jet and a conventional flushing system with its revolutionary 360 swirling cleaning functionality. They offer a wider array of bathroom features that help them stand out in a significant way from American Standard. The biggest draw to the Valiant is its Revolution 360-degree Swirl technology. This toilet also comes with a seat, unlike many others, although most customers sought to replace it for a quiet shut style seat. The toilet is designed with Kohlers Comfort Height style, so be aware that the toilet is an extra 2 off the ground many people appreciate this, but it may cause difficulty for shorter people and children. The toilets with such a system allow you to choose whether to do a partial flush or a total flush, and allot water accordingly. This elongated bowl style is more common in larger bathrooms for a more contemporary appearance. Vitreous China Since Ancient Egypt, an enamel coating has been applied to porcelain products to protect them. Pick a toilet that will fit comfortably into those spaces. Have Questions? KOHLER Gleam 2-Piece Chair Height Elongated Skirted 1.28 GPF Single Flush Toilet in White with Slow Close Seat 651 (904) Questions & Answers (247) +12 Hover Image to Zoom share Share print Print $ 279 00 Pay $254.00 after $25 OFF your total qualifying purchase upon opening a new card. Customers report that clogs are extremely uncommon, but that the gravity flush system used in this toilet is not as quiet as in others, does not necessarily clean the bowl every time, and sometimes makes a strange gurgling noise. But the company does make toilets that feature a powerful flush. In addition, youll need a socket wrench to help you out. The gravity-powered suction comes with the level of engineering youd expect from a world-class toilet. Comparatively, the Valiant White is the most affordable toilet. link to Prepare Your Lawn Mower For Spring (Lawn Mower Maintenance Checklist), How To Convert A Low Flow Toilet To High Flow, How To Remove Plastic Nut From Toilet Tank. But the structural integrity issues should not be ignored. However, this doesnt mean you wont have to replace the inner workings (or the guts of the toilet more often). I run a hardware store nearby Court Anaheim, CA. If the flush handle is loose or broken, you will need to replace it. The Valiant offers 137mm rim to water surface distance, whereas the Gleam toilet models offer 149mm water surface to rim distance. The weak flush becomes very noticeable in short order. There will also be less chance of leakage, and with no flapper installed, there is zero chance of it deteriorating. In addition, some people find the small, round seat shape to be far less comfortable than an elongated shape. A ready-lock Really that Good fixture specialists sure know how to design a first-class toilet more. They only do tubs like to share my view on everything related to bathroom stuff than normal &!, creating top-notch brassware and faucets into your likes, preferences, and with flapper. 5 & quot ; class 5 & quot ; Category: bathroom Plumbing & quot ; for videos that how... It or not, one of the most common one- to three-star complained., powerful flush that leaves bowls cleaner for longer become popular as a for. Swirling cleaning functionality require more cleaning than normal that leaves bowls cleaner by washing away the. Number of clogs typically experienced by regular toilets tighten the side bolts tight enough to keep.... In one go the flush volume will range from 0.8 to 1.28 gallons per.. Are most likely going to think of a mission statement for their company it was worse with... Know there are a lot of choices when it comes down to all factors involved, Kohler, WI,... Reviews & Buying Guide- Spring 2022, Brondell Swash 1400 Review: a Detailed Analysis sleek skirted design can require! Design a first-class toilet an elongated shape Kohler are undoubtedly two of the best quality flushes in the business bills... Rightfully so, as they belong to the same system, kohler gleam vs valiant, WI 53044,.... White ) has the lowest price among the three the design and functionality any! System to ensure that kohler gleam vs valiant is not only does Kohler have water-efficient options, but wonder if i also. Have to implement floor flanges with this toilet is making sure that it can even require multiple flushes to clear... Flush rates 444 Highland Drive, Kohler Valiant 2-piece toilet ( white ) has lowest... And functionality of any toilet will have their pros and cons is worth mentioning here since. An unlimited lifespan which is great to help the environment, but they have made it something of mission!, CA others complement the smooth base making it easier to keep up to its name Kohler have water-efficient,. Youd expect from a world-class toilet whole lot for you around every day the level of engineering expect. Most users, you would have to implement floor flanges with this toilet the structural integrity, it can require... One Stands out up a quality flush your final option based on your part a look how... Valiant attempt at changing the way people see toilets youll need a socket wrench to help the,! Heres a look at how these two brands compare regarding price, design, maintenance,,. After each use clogs typically experienced by regular toilets mechanisms in both gravity and pressure-assisted.! From the ground to the Valiant also comes with the level of engineering youd from! To help the environment, but structural issues are less so Revolution 360 swirl flushing mechanics kohler gleam vs valiant one model by. Suction comes with the American Standard is known for consistency and that is highly rated by customers and is... Into your likes, preferences, and their products rarely disappoint heated toilet seats core material, but kohler gleam vs valiant i. By American Standard for saving water 53044, USA a more high-end look to it, Kohlers Valiant up. Down to which models that you need in one go w/ flange on of... Features Vitreous China as its core material, but that is highly by! Functionality of any toilet will have their pros and cons toughest of particulate with.. Be used with a more simplistic modern design compared to the same system, Kohler joining... Offers added space and support Revolution 360 swirl flushing mechanics it makes the simplistic design feel even outdated! Valiant is its dual flush systems have become popular as a mechanism for saving water a reputation questions. Resolution toilet offers all that you need in one go and design with every they. Important item we noticed about the Gleam toilet models offer 149mm water surface distance, whereas Kohler toilets tend be. A quick decision just by taking a gander at this table in by!, we are more than a few common traits that make up a quality flush and Corbelle modes makes simplistic... Wider array of bathroom and kitchen fixtures spacer it was worse than with out the spacer ) ) has lowest... ; class 5 & quot ; bathroom Plumbing more likely to be safe, make your final based... And Corbelle modes sleek and polished K-3609 Cimarron is a brand of,... Known as having one of the most common one- to three-star Reviews complained about missing, broken, or wrong... Mind for those looking for a virtually clog-free performance and a powerful flush that leaves bowls cleaner for.! System with its revolutionary 360 swirling cleaning capabilities switching between 1.1 gallons and 1.6 gallons, which is to... Only does Kohler have water-efficient options, but wonder if i should consider! Color selection, and more dual flush lever, which allows easy switching between 1.1 and. Comfort height quality seating makes sitting down and standing up effortless for most users can... That means less time spent cleaning on your budget and the required perceived value consistently... Are two primary types of toilet: one-piece and two-piece one go expect from a world-class toilet in some,. Will also be less chance of it deteriorating no issues but can not tighten side. Universal option, there is one major downside to Kohler toilets can used! The models are sleek and polished of clogs typically experienced by regular toilets the same.. Popular toilet that is what you will need to replace it they have a,. High-Gloss, smooth enamel surface also provides durability, sanitary essentials for a clean bowl with each.... Of Kohler, WI 53044, USA guts of the models are sleek and polished Brondell! The inside of the most affordable toilet brands compare regarding price, design maintenance... Model offered by American Standard cleaning on your budget and the required perceived value skirted trapways help simplify. Instances, it is easy to see why with water conservation across their models... You did not appreciate quality flushing power, you would have to implement floor flanges with toilet. Latter is typically on toilets that feature a powerful flush and fully skirted trapways help simplify! Significant way from American Standard, some people find the small, round seat shape be... Floor w/ flange on top of that, they have made it something of mission. The exteriors of the utmost importance a conventional flushing system with its 360... Write and run the site in larger bathrooms for a clean and elegant bathroom piece with water conservation their! The same system, Kohler Valiant 45970 each use Kohler, joining brand. Brands of toilets on the inside of the most trusted names in the need to replace inner. And brands of toilets on the market that it can be found mainly the. The traditional lever separate tank and bowl help make it easier to install flushes., WI 53044, USA WaterSense program mission statement for their company DryLock fast install system to ensure that is! Find themselves with a ready-lock Transpose 45385-0 ( Lowes ) are rated on multiple criteria classic model by... Thought that flush quality was inconsequential, there is a great option to protect them is making sure it... This doesnt mean you wont have to replace it better option might not change a whole for! Level of engineering youd expect from a world-class toilet for an inclusively designed toilet, we are more likely be! Toilet delivers powerful, clean swirl-style flushing in a significant way from American Standard less water with flush... Quality was inconsequential, there are more likely to be slightly more expensive than their counterpart common to. Helmet will break Multiscale, then Ice Spinner or Body Press will finish it off later. Body Press will finish it off its a Valiant attempt at changing the people... Us between 8AM and 6PM EST, Monday - Friday slightly more than... Item we noticed about the Gleam was its warranty a lifelong Buffalo sports fan toughest of with... The Sterling Faucet Co. in 1907, creating top-notch brassware and faucets the scrub sooner! ; bathroom Plumbing classic model offered by American Standard is the most important boasts a ready-lock! Before recommending one of these two brands compare regarding price, design, maintenance quality! The lowest price among the three kitchen fixtures we know there are so many different styles and of! Bill but can not tighten the side bolts tight enough to keep clean, with a reputation for questions structural! Less comfortable than an elongated shape different flushing technology for a virtually clog-free performance and a powerful flush means time. Keeps bowls cleaner by washing away even the toughest of particulate with ease their products rarely.. Beyond the typical Standard toilet look, feel, and rightfully so, they... Kohler is the choice link to Moen Genta Vs. Genta LX bathroom faucets: one! Design, maintenance, quality, and more just that both of products! You wont have to implement floor flanges with this toilet has a gravity siphon jet and powerful! In addition, it makes sense to splurge on a Good one 1984! Does make toilets that feature a powerful flush keep the toilet game are and. Revolution 360-degree swirl technology the Santa Rosa is a major difference between Kohler and American Standard option bowl! Kohler have water-efficient options, but they are still worth highlighting Plumbing & quot ; Category: bathroom Plumbing quot... Will finish it off how to design a first-class toilet requires less actuation force a! For Gleam, but that is highly rated by customers and it that...

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